Episode Transcript
[00:00:02] Speaker A: Welcome to Align for Impact. I'm your host, Matthew Naylor. I started this podcast because healthcare and leadership both come down to the same thing. Alignment. When people, purpose and performance connect, real impact happens.
On this show, we'll talk with entrepreneurs, brokers and change makers who are challenging what is broken in healthcare and in business and find new ways to make a difference for companies, communities and the people they serve.
So, Joe, welcome to the show. I'm Matt Narrell. I'm the host. It's Alignment for Impact. Alignment and impact are a big thing with me in my life and I'm really looking forward to our conversation today. You know, Joe, you, you are the CFO of the Parcel company out in Ohio and Wilmington, Delaware.
My bad.
[00:01:00] Speaker B: We're close.
[00:01:01] Speaker A: I would love to know, Joe, just, just where'd you grow up? Let's you know where. How'd you get started? How'd you build your career?
[00:01:10] Speaker B: Yeah. So I grew up in a tiny town in northeast Pennsylvania. Yep. Carbondale, Pennsylvania.
[00:01:16] Speaker A: I love Carbondale.
[00:01:17] Speaker B: Carbon.
So I grew up there.
My entire childhood was there.
I went to college in northeast Pennsylvania at King's College.
[00:01:29] Speaker A: Nice.
[00:01:32] Speaker B: When I graduated school, I worked up in the Scranton area and realized that there was not a lot of opportunities up there for young guys like me.
So I started looking around. I came down to Wilmington, Delaware. I did public accounting for, though 18 years.
Found a great opportunity for me to get out of public accounting and go into the corporate world.
And was lucky enough to meet Jim, Maureen Johnson, who gave me the opportunity to come into Parcels and be their controller and take over their financials.
And I've been there ever since for 17 years.
[00:02:13] Speaker A: 17 years. Tell me a little bit, Joe. You know, so Crumbdale specialty is, you know, providing some, I think very unique and very distinctive services and solutions around, you know, level funded, self funded and captives for self insured employers. You know, tell me a little bit about your, just your experience at Parcel. Why tell us about Parcel in the business?
[00:02:35] Speaker B: So Parcels is, you know, we get this question all the time, what does Parcels do? You know, and you know, myself and my fellow owners, we always have a difficult time answering the question because we do so many things.
We're a client service based organization. So we take care of lawyers, corporate lawyers, corporations, the courts in Wilmington, Delaware. Delaware being the really the corporate capital of the country where most of your Fortune 500 companies are incorporated in Delaware because of their chancery court and their favorable rules to business.
So they look at that as a place to set up shop in terms of incorporating so when that happens and they have litigation, those litigations have to happen in Wilmington, Delaware. So this all started, you know, parcel started as a hand delivery courier business 40, 45 years ago.
[00:03:34] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:03:34] Speaker B: And when you, you'd have five gym started with five people just handing hand delivering to from lawyer to lawyer, court to lawyer, lawyer to court.
And it grew to what it is today in terms of, you know, now we are electronic discovery business, we're a forensic e discovery business to trial support, trial production, witness binders for all the courts.
You know, you talk, you go from revenue from 2 million to what we're doing today, almost 25, $30 million. And we really grew with technology and how the law firms had to grow to be able to handle their, their cases.
[00:04:19] Speaker A: And Joe, how many people do you, how many teammates, how many employees do you have in the company?
[00:04:23] Speaker B: Right now? We have about 110 employees.
[00:04:25] Speaker A: 110 employees. You know, healthcare in this country is broken. It's been broken for a very long time. I've had the good, good fortune of having a bird's eye view into it for the last 30 years.
But, you know, there's not a lot of great solutions out there in the marketplace where people and you know, you're in Delaware, you know, I'm sure there's, you know, Aetna solution, I'm sure there's a sickness solution, I'm sure there's a Blue Cross solution. You know, for that matter, maybe there's even a united solution. And not that they're bad companies, but small employers don't have great choice. They don't have great access to data. They don't have the ability to make great decisions and truly understand what's going on with their healthcare plan. And it's very opaque, you know, and, and that's one of the big problems, the lack of transparency.
You know, as a cfo, I'm sure that, you know, you have a perspective on how do you manage this big line item expense, you know, in your business. Can you just, you know, 17 years at parcels before the Crumbdale specialty. Can you just describe for me in the audience kind of what you were doing year over year with trying to manage and mitigate your health insurance?
[00:05:30] Speaker B: Sure.
So, you know, I'll tell you this. Every October, November, I knew what was coming. So we would talk to our broker who was a partner of yours at usi, and I'd be waiting to hear what's our increase going to be in the fully insured market. And it became very frustrating as a service based Organization. Our biggest asset is our people.
Almost 50% of our total revenue goes to taking care of our people. And healthcare is one of the biggest costs for that.
To be able to educate and provide great quality healthcare is important to us because we're family parcels is a family. And the increasing frustration in dealing with the big carriers became too much. You know, Buzzy presented us with the level fundament model that you guys developed, you know, two, three years ago. And it worked. And it worked great. You know, and that, that's what gave us the confidence to say, all right, you guys are rolling out this new program, the captive program.
I've been in a captive for PNC for 13 years. I know how it works. If we can make this for healthcare, it's a win win for you guys and it's a win win for us for sure.
[00:06:54] Speaker A: And how, you know, so fully insured, not getting a lot of data, you know, there Joe, for 17 years, year over year, broker shows up and they're good brokers, they have good intention, but you know, they're just passing along increases year over year over year. And you as a cfo, I'm sure you have choices like does the company bear the burden of that expense or do you try to change deductibles and copays and plan design to pass along some of the cost to the burden to the employees. I'm assuming that was really, really frustrating for you.
[00:07:28] Speaker B: It really was. You know, I'll tell you this, this is the first year in my 17 years of parcels that we did not increase our employees contribution to the health plan. How first time, because of the model that you guys presented to us compared to what we were doing before, it made sense to say, you know what, we're going to keep everything the same. The costs are similar to what they were in the previous year and there's not going to be an increase. And even better was we didn't have to change any of our plan design, the cards didn't have to change, the system didn't change, everything was seamless and it made so much sense to us.
The biggest thing to me in being part of this program is, and I said it yesterday on the panel, is data. Data is an asset. It's an asset to you guys, it's an asset to us. So we see the claim amounts and I've been through this with the PNC side of it, you know, the more data you get, you can help adjudicate your claims because you're saving dollars for yourself, you're saving dollars for Your employees?
[00:08:33] Speaker A: Yeah. And Joe, we at Crumbdale Specialty we have like this very thoughtful, very intentional, very methodical approach to taking a, an employer like yourself at parcel 100 employees started by an entrepreneur, you know, family run, you know, we, we have a process of taking you from fully insured to level funded. Can you just share a little bit about what that experience looked like for you?
[00:09:00] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. So as I said, we had looked at the captive model years ago, we could never find a fit, you know, and as I said, it became increasingly frustrating every year to get sit down with our broker and be told, well, you have a 17% increase and you have no idea why.
Moving to the level funded model, it gave us the data to say.
And you would meet with your broker monthly or quarterly to say here's what your claims look like, this is where it's going. So you have predictability in it, you know where you're headed and to move towards that and finally move into the captive where I see bills weekly, you know, I know where the claims are going, I know what the dollars are spent and I know where things are going to the future and helps me financially say, okay, you know, we have, we have an issue with an employee, somebody's really sick or somebody has an issue, has a problem. I know where those costs are going to come from, I know what we're going to have to do and I know that I have conversations with Buzzy or whoever my broker is to, to be help adjudicate those and make sure that my employees are taken care of.
[00:10:19] Speaker A: And Joe, how did you make the decision to go from our level funded solution into our high performing captive?
[00:10:27] Speaker B: So that to me that was, that was really easy.
As I said, I've been a part of a PNC captive for years, so I know the, the model in perception. I don't know really how it works healthcare wise, but I know the ultimate outcome.
Being able to see the data, having a whole bunch of transparency, to be able to make decisions around it and know that there's a benefit to.
I'm going to be part of something bigger. I'm going to be able to really direct or be a part of something that directs the direction of a captive. It's ownership, it's risk taking and it's ownership.
[00:11:09] Speaker A: That's awesome. You know, at Cromdale Specialty, you know, we really focus on clients for a lifetime. We really aspire to set a new standard on how to create a great experience for a cfo, an HR person, an owner, an operator, an employer, a member can you just speak, Joe, to your experience on how we've delivered a new standard and client services?
[00:11:36] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. As I said to you before we started, you know, the biggest investment that you guys have done and I really appreciate is, is the great people that you have around you. And that goes without saying. It's, it's, it's a partnership. So this is something that we look at as a long term investment with Crumbdale and a long term investment in our employees to make their lives better, you know, and grow the Captive as one of the initial founding members of the Captive, to be part of something bigger, you know, it's going to be good for, it's going to be good for the people and our employees.
[00:12:19] Speaker A: Joe, how does the Crumbdale team show up every day when, you know, like, we're not perfect? No business is perfect. But there's always issues, there's always challenges, there's always problems. And you know, one of the things that was really frustrating for me as a consumer of healthcare is like you would call 1-800-X-Y&Z and nobody would respond. You know, we've built a business that's around optimization and integration and member engagement, advocacy, member experience, just a little more on, you know, how you feel. We show up as an organization to solve problems for you and your employees.
[00:12:55] Speaker B: Sure. You know, I, I think I deal with, I think I deal with your people at Crumdale more than any vendor that I deal with on a weekly basis. And, and that's a good thing for me. You know, I deal with Nicoletta. I, I probably send her two or three emails a day or, or a week.
I deal with buzz.
You know, I met Jim Anders down here. Jim called me two weeks ago and say, hey, I'm part of the executive team. I'm reaching out. If you need somebody to contact to get something done, I'm another person for you. So there's, it's about building relationships, you know, and that's. Our business is the same way. You know, we want, our business is built on client relationships. And so they, they want to work with you. And I feel the same way about Crumbdale. You know, I met Tanya.
Everybody is, everybody's been great and they care about parcels, which is important to me.
[00:13:54] Speaker A: Yeah, there's a deep conviction to really, truly setting a new standard. And what I love hearing you say earlier, Joe, is, you know, you went fully insured, level funded. Now you're in a high before, high performing captive. And for the first time in many, many, many years, you didn't have to pass along a big increase to your yourself as an employer and then change deductibles, change co pays, change benefits and pass along a large increase to your employees. How does that make you feel as a cfo?
[00:14:26] Speaker B: I mean, it makes me feel great. A, there's predictability. I know what our costs are. So, you know, as I said to you earlier, one of our biggest costs is taking care of employees and health, health insurance is part of that.
We are very generous in our employer contribution to that. And to be able to say, all right, I know what my costs are going to be because I'm not changing them. And the employees say this is great, I don't get an increase in health insurance. You know, with the way things are in the world today, that's a big deal for a lot of our employees.
[00:14:58] Speaker A: And Joe, as you, you know, you've partnered so amazing.
Your partnership with us at Crumbdale Specialty is truly, is amazing. Your feedback, your collaboration, all that is incredible.
Where do you see this relationship going? Have you looked out like a year, two, three, four, five years from now? What are you hoping for?
[00:15:20] Speaker B: I, I, I'm, I'm not hoping for it. I know it's going to be a fact that our relationship is only going to be stronger because it's already strong. And what you guys have built and passed along to us, I'm in it for the long haul parcels. Is it for the long haul? Because I know from past experience, I know we're going to be taken care of. I know that you guys are building something that is special in the healthcare world and it's very exciting to be a part of.
[00:15:49] Speaker A: Thanks, Joe. Joe, I appreciate the time. I'm looking forward to continuing the partnership. Thanks very much.
[00:15:53] Speaker B: Appreciate it.
[00:15:57] Speaker A: This is Matthew Naylor. You've been listening to Aligned for Impact.
